January 2009: Mansfield Park by Jane Austen

Primogeniture

The social system was based on the concept of primogeniture (yes I looked that up), the right of the first born son to inherit the entire estate. How does Austen treat this class system in Mansfield Park?

Just wanted to let you know I am going to start reading this book tonight! Then I can answer the questions
-Bookworm

I know. I need to get on here and answer all of them too.
-Annegirl

The Crawfords esteem

The Crawfords seem to among the tiny handful of people who see the value of Fanny Price. Are they ever unkind to her? Why is Fanny so little moved by their interest and esteem? In your opinion, is any of this esteem genuine?

Exactly!

I think this is a really good point. Mary Crawford seems to recognize Fanny as a threat right from the start, so she keeps her enemies close, so to speak. She knew she'd have to be kind to Fanny in order to keep the wool pulled over Edmund's eyes. I think she was unkind to Fanny by acting like a friend in order to further her own purposes with Edmund, and her brother's plans with Fanny. I think she would've willingly kept Fanny in the dark about Henry's behavior if it wouldn't have come out. I think she does have some admiration for her moral character though.

It seems that Henry genuinely admired Fanny. I almost think that he mistook genuine admiration for love because he'd never had true regard for any of the women he got involved with before Fanny. He would flirt with women to expose their moral weakness, really. But he couldn't do it with Fanny and it stunned him into awed admiration ;) He was definitely unkind in the way he set out to "undo" her. But then once he felt like he was in love with her, I think in a way it was still unkind to seek her hand when she was so clearly superior in moral character. He must've known he couldn't deserve her without a "true conversion" to goodness. Obviously he didn't make it there :(

That's why Fanny is a great h e r o i n e (Can I just say that I h a t e the name Fanny? I hope that's no one's middle name!). With all the attention from the Crawfords that anybody else would be thrilled to have, she didn't bank on it. She was always kind to them, but never counted on their kindness to her in the way that most people would. She didn't let it go to her head. We all are eager to be loved, but Fanny was very careful about who influenced her. And this concludes my book report on "Mansfield Park". Thank you. ;)

-Sanya the Duck

I agree on all your points. I never really thought Mary did much that wouldn't suit her in the end. I also agree with what you said about Henry. He wasn't used to having someone not fall for him and I think that did make him sit up to notice what she was really about. If she had married him I'm sure that he would have immediately slipped back into his ways and not admired her as much anymore.
I am not a fan of the name fanny either.
Love your last sentence by the way... funny!
-Annegirl

Waiting

Fanny Price spends a great deal of the book sitting and waiting. We see this in particular in the chapter where they visit Mr. Rushworth's Sotherton estate. Discuss the significance of Fanny's waiting in this chapter and her waiting throughout the novel as a whole.

She waited the whole book. She waited for Edmund to notice her, for letters from her brother, for visits from her brother, for her horse, etc... I think she was so used to waiting that she wouldn't know what to do with herself if she got something first.

-Annegirl

I think all the waiting was necessary to let Austen shine in her ultra talent - which is observing human nature. We really get to know the characters through Fanny's watchful eyes. I'll reword it: Fanny waits and watches so Austen can show off her knowledge of human nature. And from what we hear about Austen's life, it sounds like she probably spent her whole life waiting as well!
-Sanya the Duck

Good observation!
-Annegirl

Mrs. Norris

Find something good to say about Mrs. Norris.

umm... that she gets what she deserves in the end?! ha ha! I think Mrs. Norris has good intentions. She was the one who came up with the idea of taking Fanny in at the beginning of the story. Even though she wasn't willing to actually help with it, her plan got Fanny to Mansfield Park. She also seems to love her nieces' and have their best interests at heart, although she doesn't seem to have very good judgement there either. And what a meanie she is to Fanny!
-Sanya the Duck

I am impressed! I was wondering if anyone could come up with something and now that I've read your post I realize that maybe I was too hard on her. I guess she may have had good intentions. She just drove me nuts. That's why I wasn't born into a 'class' society I guess - even though sometimes I really think I should have been born in an old fashioned time. I would have been the one that stood up and dumped the drinks over poor old Mrs. Norris' head.
-Annegirl

Nope, I h a t e d her too. But you said to come up with SOMETHING and that was what I found. What a horrible creature she was!
-Sanya the Duck

Favorite Characters

Who are your favorite and least favorite characters?

Fanny and Mr. C.

Of course Fanny was a favorite. I wish she wasn't so timid, but I love her for her outstanding moral character.

Henry Crawford was another favorite, but for completely different reasons! Obviously he isn't the of moral fortitude. But his character brought an excitement to the book. I loved that despite the fact that he was always a total player, he did come to a point of recognizing Fanny's worth and goodness, and it seemed to make a change in him. Unfortunately, he just admired Fanny's goodness and didn't share it!

I liked Edmund for his kindness to Fanny. He is a very human character - basically a good guy, but susceptible to Mary Crawford's charms and influence.

-Sanya the Duck

I agree with your favorites. I felt bad that Fanny didn't stand up for herself and was so timid (she reminded me of Molly from Wives and Daughters in this way) but she was still such a good person.
I found that most of the exciting and most interesting parts of the book were a result of Henry being around.
I like Edmund because he is so kind and so worried about Fanny throughout the book , even before he loved her. He also had high moral character although he did go against his own feelings occasionally. That did make him seem more like a real guy.
I did not like his sister and I think that is partly because she seemed amused by her brother playing with emotions, partly because she seemed to love Edmund but would not have been with him if he followed his chosen profession, and partly because I wasn't certain that her kindness to Fanny wasn't fake.
And my least favorite was of course Mrs. Norris the old babble ax ... (is that how you spell that?)
-Annegirl

Fanny Price

Jane Austen seems to have considered Mansfield Park her best work, but many readers don't take kindly to Fanny Price as the heroine. Why might that be so? Do you feel that way about her, or do you find her an attractive and sympathetic character? Explain.

Difference

How is Mansfield Park different from other Austen novels like Sense and Sensibility and Pride and Prejudice? How is it similar?

Sisters

At the heart of its plot, Mansfield Park has three sisters. What kind of family life do you imagine would account for Mrs. Bertram, Mrs. Norris, and Mrs. Price?

A Long Wait

Mansfield Park was written after a silence of more than a decade. During this period, Austen moved several times, saw the deaths of her father and potential suitor, and became the dependent old maid we find so often among her characters. The Napoleonic Wars continued; England embarked on imperialistic adventures. Austen followed both with interest. Do you see evidence of these things in the novel?

Lovers Vows

The production of Lovers' Vows occurs despite the fact that the whole cast knows that Sir Thomas would disaprove. Discuss why he might feel this way , and the consequence of his absence on his family.

Brothers

The Bertram brothers are very different. What makes them so?

Improvements

The word "improvements" is used throughout Mansfield Park. Discuss the social significance of improvements.

Antiuga Plantation

Although the Antigua plantation doesn't at first seem important, it plays a vital role in the novel. Discuss how Sir Thomas's Caribbean estate functions in the novel as a whole.